gooood团队采访世界各地 35岁以下的年轻创意人，他们有的是创业者，有的是业主，有的是普通职员。我们探访众生百相，记录这个时代年轻人的面貌和真实状态，欢迎您的推荐和建议。
第52期为您介绍的是独立室内设计师 罗秀达。更多关于他，请至：Luo Xiuda on gooood

gooood team interviews creative individuals under 35 years old from all over the world, some are pioneering founders, some are clients, some are ordinary practitioners. gooood is trying to record the authentic living and working states of this era. Your recommendations and suggestions are appreciated!
gooood Under 35 NO.52 introduces independent interior designer Luo Xiuda. More about him: Luo Xiuda on gooood

出品人：向玲 / Producer: Xiang Ling
编辑：武晨曦，陈诺嘉，杨子遥 / Editor: Wu Chenxi, Chen Nuojia, Yang Ziyao

▼视频，Video
（全文深度采访见下方文字。视频为4分钟精华版，建议选择1080p高清版本观看）

__________
成为独立设计师
Becoming an independent designer

我4岁左右开始画画，算是特长生。大学选择了环境艺术设计专业，毕业之后自然而然地参加了室内设计的工作，主要的范围是做家装设计。在公司里工作了几年后，觉得自己如果独立就能在项目和客户的选择范围上都相对自由一些，这时刚好赶上互联网提供了比较好的平台，能够给我提供一个以独立设计师的身份来工作的机会。

我的日常工作主要有两部分，一是设计，二是施工现场的跟进。设计的部分我主要是在家里面完成，时间是很自由的。我会根据我的状态去工作，比如晚上我突然有想法了，就从床上爬起来画一会儿。我大约一周或至少两周去一次现场，因为我的项目基本都在北京，所以也比较方便去跟工人或者屋主对接一些装修上的问题。

I have been drawing since I was four. I majored in Environmental Art Design in university and later, logically, became an interior designer after graduation. I worked in a company for a few years, after which I found that I could be relatively free in the choice of both projects and clients if I do my own business, and fortunately I happened to met with the boom of online media that can largely support me to practice as an independent interior designer.

There are two major parts of my daily work: design and the follow-up part on the construction site. The design part is mainly done at home with a loose schedule. For example, if an idea suddenly comes up to my mind, I will get up from bed and pick up my pen to draw for a while. During the construction phase I go to the site once a week or at least once every two weeks, since my projects are basically in Beijing, which is convenient for me to discuss details with my clients and the construction staff.

▼罗秀达在家的办公环境
Luo Xiuda’ s working place at home © 图片由罗秀达提供

在四、五年前，我的工作强度非常大，一年要做10个项目左右。随着对自身的了解，我的工作节奏放慢了很多，现在一年大约做4到5个项目。我通常能保证在设计阶段不会同时进行两个项目，也就是必须保持单一的设计状态。

无论是什么样的工作方式，最终都是要对接到客户。作为独立设计师，这有可能是最垂直地对接客户的方式，它省掉了很多环节和沟通的成本；当然也存在劣势，比如当你状态不好的时候，有很多因素会导致工作需要暂时停下。但如果你在一个团队或公司，多少还是有人能帮你把工作继续下去。

My schedules were very demanding about four or five years ago as I had to do about 10 projects a year. It was a gradual process that I slowed down my pace and now have four or five projects per year. Basically I have to guarantee for no more than two projects on going simultaneously, which allows me to maintain full focus on each project.

Regardless of the way of work, we ultimately have to interface with our clients. As an independent designer, this is probably the most straightforward and efficient way to understand the clients’ needs and hopes, since it can eliminate a lot of procedure and communication costs. Of course, there are also disadvantages, like you may have to interrupt the design sometimes when you are not in good shape. This can be avoid if you are in a team or relied on a company.

▼罗秀达部分代表作，part of the projects by Luo Xiuda © 金伟琦 ©刘李卓

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敏感而简单
Sensitive but simple

“我希望简单而有力量地去解决问题，这也是我长期坚持的事情。”

“I think it is my philosophy to solve problems simply but powerfully, which is also one of the things I insist on in the long run.”

我是一个很敏感也很敏锐的人。在一个空间被设计之前、处于空置状态的时候，我就会对它产生很多认知跟想法，这种第一印象是非常鲜活的，它会储存在我的记忆里。在后续的设计当中，我会反复地用它来验证我的设计。

我在工作之前接受的是长期的绘画和美术基础教育，我觉得这有两方面的好处，一方面是让我对美的感知比较清晰明确；另一方面，绘画最能够培养一个人的观察能力，包括观察事物之间的关系，这些都会潜移默化地作用于我对于材料、色彩和空间的感知。

我比较喜欢简单的人和事，这一点也根植在我的生活状态里，影响着我的思考和行为模式。我追求简单，但是我不认为凡事一定要极简，因为在很多情况下，极简的背后隐藏着一些复杂的方法。我希望简单而有力量地去解决问题，这也是我长期坚持的事情。

I’m a sensitive and perceptive type of person. I always have a variety of perceptions and ideas on a space before it is remodeled and designed. These vivid first impressions are going to be stored in my memory and can be retrieved at any time in subsequent stages to repeatedly verify my design.

I received a long-term basic education in painting and art before working, which I think has benefited me a lot, letting me have a more explicit perception of aesthetics, as well as helping strengthen my ability of observation, including observing the relationship between things. All these will implicitly influence my sensibility to materials, colors and spatial experience in design.

I am fond of simple people and simple things, and this has subtly affected my way of thinking and behaving. I pursue simplicity, but I don’t persist in minimalism, because in many cases there are complex methods hidden behind. I think it is my philosophy to solve problems simply but powerfully, which is also one of the things I insist on in the long run.

▼罗秀达的一些旅行摄影，Some photography by Luo Xiuda during travel © 罗秀达

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做室内设计
要兼顾“个性化”和“纯粹性”
Interior design is a balance of
Individuality and purity

“当屋主的个性跟我作为设计师提供的这部分纯粹的基础相结合的时候，才能真正创造出一个完整的家。”

“When the client’s individuality is combined with the pure base that I provide as a designer, a true home can be eventually completed.”

“个性化”和“纯粹性”并不矛盾。首先，我希望我的设计是简单和纯粹一些的。我不能替一个屋主做完全部的工作，但我能提供一个良好的基础，为他在日后的生活当中创造更多的可能性。比如说业主的家庭人数在几年后可能有所在增加，这些变动都是要考虑到的。关于“个性”，我觉得空间跟人一样，每个空间有不同的优点和缺点，屋主也有不同的职业和性格。能够体现屋主气质的，是他的物品、他的配饰、是与他的生活息息相关的小的物件。当屋主的“个性”跟我作为设计师提供的这部分纯粹的基础相结合的时候，才能真正创造出一个完整的家。

I don’t think individuality and purity are two contradictory things. First of all, I want my design to be simple and to reflect purity, but there is a limit to what a designer could do. When people physically move in a house, they will use the spaces in different ways. What an interior designer can do is to provide a good base, so that the homeowner can have more possibilities to live comfortably in the future. For example, changes in family members should be taken into account to create flexible living spaces for following generations. Just like people having different personalities, spaces also have their own individualities, which may find expression in specific furniture pieces, accessories and all those small objects that are closely related to their owners’ daily life. When this part of the individuality is combined with the pure base that I provide as a designer, a true home can be eventually completed.

▼罗秀达设计手稿，Design sketches by Luo Xiuda © 罗秀达

任何一个行业都会有它自己的流行趋势，这是一个大的市场动态。但是对于个人来讲，我觉得有一个比较明确的方向就可以，风格并不是那么绝对或者那么重要的事情。比如说我们所谓的新中式风格，它其实是要建立在一个文化背景下去理解的。与其追求这些，倒不如回归生活的本质，回归到你的需求、生活习惯和你对于家的期待和感觉上。这些东西是你每天可以触碰和切身感受到的，要比所谓的风格、所谓的文化更贴合实际。说到底，家还是要给人一种安全的、舒适的感觉。

In any industry, whether it is interior design, fashion design, or some other design industry, there is a trend, which reflects the dynamics of a huge market. But for individuals, style is less important than it is usually imagined, and it will be sufficient for a client to have a relatively clear direction in his or her mind before starting an interior project. What really matters is whether the design can response to your need, your habits, your expectations and feelings about home. These are the things you touch and feel personally in everyday life, which is much more realistic and meaningful than the so-called style. Ultimately, a home must give people a safe and comfortable feeling.

▼罗秀达作品：“和平村”。该项目是为一家三口设计的居所，屋主爱好阅读与美食
Residence A of Hepingcun Village. A residence for a family of three, whose host is in hobby of reading and cooking © 金伟琦
点击这里查看更多，Click HERE for details

▼和平村装修前后，Before and after renovation © 罗秀达 © 金伟琦

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色彩和材料
Colors and materials

“生活当中每天的变动是很有趣的。如果从基础上把材料控制到比较简单的程度，它对后期新生的变化会有更好的包容性和可持续性。”

“It is always a better choice to maintain the unity of a space. It is much more interesting to see such unpredictable changes in one’s daily life than getting everything equipped right from the start.”

色彩是很个人的感受，每个人对色彩的感知非常不一样，有的人认为明亮的色彩能带来愉悦感和欢快感，有的人则是觉得稍微深沉一点的颜色可以带来安定感和宁静感。在项目开始的时候，我会跟屋主进行初步的沟通，彼此会有一个基本的契合度和默契度，当然主要还是以屋主的个人喜好为主。我觉得空间是空间，功能是功能，色彩只是附着于感官的非常个人心理化的需求。我比较喜欢稍微统一一点的感觉。材料的复杂会让空间产生膨胀感。尤其在小户型里面，不管是色彩的对比，体块的对比，材质的对比，太丰富了都会增加这种膨胀感。如果能够在材料上做一些减法，可以起到从视觉上放大空间的效果。生活当中每天的变动是很有趣的，可能我今天买了一个物品，明天朋友送了我一幅画，这些东西是很难控制的。如果从基础上把材料控制到比较简单的程度，它对后期新生的变化会有更好的包容性和可持续性。

Color is related to a very personal feeling, and everyone has different perception of color. Some people think brightness colors can bring a sense of pleasure and joy, while others may feel calmness and tranquility from a palette of darker colors. At the beginning of each project, I will have a preliminary communication with my client, so that we can come to a basic agreement on the proposal of design, which is mainly according to the owner’s personal preference. From my point of view, it is always a better choice to maintain the unity of a space, especially in small apartments. Too much contrast of colors and materials will make the space over-inflated, while appropriate subtraction can visually extend the spatial experience. It is much more interesting to see such unpredictable changes in one’s daily life than getting everything equipped right from the start.

▼罗秀达作品：“未間”。通过深色调营造包裹感的生活场景 © 金伟琦
“Wei Jian” by Luo Xiuda. With dark colors, the design aims at constructing life scenes that conserves more life style
点击这里查看更多，Click HERE for details

▼“未間” 装修前后，Before and after renovation ©罗秀达 © 金伟琦

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空间
Space

“我在项目前期会做一个家庭成员的需求调研表，把大部分需求通过语言交流和文字记录梳理出来，然后再来做设计。”

“At the beginning of each project I will make a list to figure out the key requirements proposed by each of the families, and next comes the design.”

小户型并不一定是拥挤的，还是要看家庭成员的人数。一个人住四五十平米的小户型也可以很舒服，甚至可以用“奢侈”来形容。但如果是一家多代人居住，这时候要考虑的因素就复杂很多。我需要兼顾到所有家庭成员的需要，让所有功能符合全家人在一天24小时内动态的、变化的使用。然后收纳也是一个比较重要的因素，它会影响人居住的心情和状态。对于小户型，我通常会分两种情况，如果是一个人居住，可能我会更多地考虑舒适性，然后在这个基础上放大屋主的个人爱好和个性。如果是一家人使用，我会更多地考虑共享空间，以及如何妥帖地安排收纳空间，例如尽量使其向四周的墙面靠拢，让出更多的活动空间给全家人使用。

The comfort of living does not depend on the size of the house, but on the number of its end users. For a person who live alone, a 40 to 50 square-meter apartment can definitely be comfortable, or even can be seen as luxury. When it comes to a multi-generational family, there will be much more complex considerations. The needs of everyone in the family have to be taken into account, and all functions should be arranged in place to meet the dynamic and changing use in the 24 hours. Another important consideration is storage, as it can affect the user’s mood and state of living. When designing a mini-sized unit, I usually provide customized solutions for different types of occupants. For example, personal preferences will be prioritized when designing for the only occupant, or else more attention will be paid to storage and shared spaces.

▼罗秀达作品：“共同的家”。该项目是一个学区房，设计需要在提供学习空间的同时，满足爷爷奶奶的日常居住需要。
“SYM HOUSE” is a school district housing. The major demand is to meet the daily living demands of the young grandparents while providing the child with place to do homework. © 金伟琦
点击这里查看更多，Click HERE for details

▼“共同的家”改造前后，Before and after renovation © 罗秀达 © 金伟琦

像SULI这个房子是一个人住，所以设计完全可以从屋主的爱好出发。比如说他喜欢看书，我就在最明显的地方放了一个书柜，用书柜来划分起居室跟睡眠空间。这些都是为了让业主充分享受独居生活，放大自身的个性。“共同的家”相对更实用、功能性更强一些，因为它要满足一家三代人的居住需求。同样是小户型，但你要面对的问题和解决的方向是完全不同的。

Taking SULI House as an example, it is designed for a single owner, so the top priority is to make the intervention coincident with his habit and beauty appreciation. A customized book-shelf was installed as a prominent element in the house, which also functions as the partition that separates the living room from the sleeping area. All these are to let the owner enjoy the life of living alone and to enlarge his personality. In SYM House, the design focused more on practicability and functionality, as it would be used by three generations of the family. While it is also a small-sized residence, what you have to consider and provide solutions for can be completely different.

▼罗秀达作品：“SULI房屋改造”。设计移除了原空间内的3处隔墙，将原本各自独立的小空间化零为整，形成一个开阔舒适的空间。© 金伟琦
“SULI House”. Three walls in the original room were removed to change the small and separated room into one, forming an open and cosy space.
点击这里查看更多，Click HERE for details

▼“SULI”房屋改造前后，Before and after renovation © 罗秀达 © 金伟琦

我在项目前期会做一个家庭成员的需求调研表，把大部分需求通过语言交流和文字记录梳理出来，然后再来做设计——这已经初步地解决了大部分的问题。然后重点是要考虑空间的使用频率，比如卫生间对于人口多的住房而言就是一个高频使用的空间。如何在满足每个人的使用需求的同时，又不影响使用时间的交错，我觉得类似的问题要比装修风格或者漂亮程度重要得多。

At the beginning of each project I will make a survey booklet to figure out the key requirements proposed by each of the families, and next comes the design. This can solve most of the problems that might occur in the following stages. Another significant factor is the frequency of use, for example, the bathroom should be considered as a “hot spot”for a multi-membered family. Meeting everyone’s needs without affecting each other’s routine, I think such kind of issues are more important than style or decorations.

▼罗秀达发给屋主的需求调研手册，The survey booklet that Luo Xiuda sends to his clients © 罗秀达

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为什么要找设计师？
Why do homeowners need a designer?

“你可以把你的想法，甚至你认为不可能实现的想法讲出来，设计师也许是可以帮你实现的。”

“You can express all your ideas, even those you think are impossible to achieve, because the designer you hire might be able to deal with it.”

请设计师来设计自宅，能够提供更多可能性跟选择性，因为专业的人会提出专业的方法和解决问题的新角度。在沟通得很好的情况下是可以产生很多良性的火花和灵感的。一方面，你可以把你的想法，甚至你认为不可能实现的想法讲出来，设计师也许是可以帮你实现的。另一方面，你的想法可能并不是你真实需要的，这时候设计师也可以帮你做减法来处理掉多余的部分。总的来说设计师应该是让整个事情的效率变得更高，这也是为什么我会建议业主找专业的人来提供帮助。

Hiring a designer to design your home can at least provide more possibilities and options. A professional designer brings professional methods and new angles to solve problems. With smooth communication, it is more likely to generate a lot of sparks and inspiration. On the one hand, you can speak out all your ideas, even those you think are impossible to achieve, because the designer you hire might be able to deal with it. On the other hand, the idea you tell may not correspond to what you really need. In this case the designer can help you evaluate your true demand and then cut the redundant part down. A designer is supposed to make the whole thing more efficient. This is why I suggest each new homeowner to find a specialized interior designer to help achieve a better result.

▼罗秀达作品：“开合之间”。一个为三口之家设计的色调冷静克制的居所，设计师希望它能给屋主一家带来宁静舒适的感受。© 金伟琦
“The Space of Switch” is a house for a familiy of three. The designer wants to achieve free flow of lights and air, harmony and cosy of human and space under the roof.
点击这里查看更多，Click HERE for details

“我在项目结束之后也会跟屋主进行交流，大部分客户都可以成为朋友。”

“I also keep contact with my clients after the project is finished, and most of them can become friends.”

屋主其实并没有能力去掌控好整个施工的过程，尤其是细节上的对接。比如说要把效果图里的灰色墙面转移到真实的空间里面，这个过程中会有成千上万种选择：它是粗糙的还是细腻的？是亮面的还是哑光的？颜色是深还是浅？这其中的“度”是非常微妙的。所以项目后期我通常会继续跟进材料的选择，包括跟各个工种的现场对接，这对于提高整个设计的还原度会有极大的帮助。至于这个部分到底应不应该算是设计师的工作，我其实不太在意，因为我本身比较爱好这个事情，所以通常是很有动力去做的。每次跟现场的师傅们交流的时候，我都能学到很多从实用角度去解决问题的办法。我在项目结束之后也会跟屋主进行交流，大部分客户都可以成为朋友。当他们在生活和使用中遇到一些问题时也会及时反馈给我，这样我在下一个项目进行的时候就可以规避掉一些问题。

The homeowner, or the client, hardly have the ability to control the entire construction process, especially the details. For example, if I’m going to finish a gray wall in the space, how could I take the color accurately from the rendering? Is it rough or smooth? Is it matte or glossy? Should it be darker or lighter? There are thousands of options when it comes to the stage of implementation. This is why I always extend my work to further stages, such as the selection of materials and communicating with the workers on site, which I think is of great help to the completeness of the whole design, not to speak of that is what I love to do. I have learned a lot from the on-site workers, as some of them have 20 to 30 years of work experience, which provided me with valuable resource so that I could consider details from a practical perspective. I also keep contact with my clients after the project is finished, and most of them can become friends. The feedback from my clients can be very helpful in the later projects.

▼罗秀达和施工人员在项目现场
Luo Xiuda and construction workers at the project site © 图片来自罗秀达

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作为房主
装修前要做好哪些准备？
As a homeowner, what preparations should be made？

“施工阶段每一个环节都是环环相扣的。一定要在沟通当中，把信息公开化、透明化。”

“All construction stages are interlocked with each other, so it is very important to make all information open and transparent during the pre-design discussion.”

作为屋主，你一定要很清楚自己想要什么，想要一个什么样的生活空间？当所有问题梳理清楚之后，你和设计师的沟通就会变得清晰而简单。如果说不是很清楚自己的需求，你的审美和喜好可能会在设计和装修期间持续发生变化，从而不断地产生质疑，这种情况就会带来很多变动。如果是设计阶段还相对好调整，但是到了施工阶段，每一个环节都是环环相扣的，如果中间突然产生变化会让整个状态非常凌乱，结果也就不甚理想。所以设计师和业主之间最重要的还是沟通，一定要在沟通当中，把信息公开化、透明化。

另外我不是很建议刚一入住就很“满”的状态。空间跟人之间有很微妙的气场，你是可以慢慢体会和调整的。比如某天你在家具店看到一款沙发，或者你遇到一幅画，把它带回家，随后它跟你的空间产生了新的情感上的链接和有趣的故事，那么它也就变成了你生活的一部分。

As a homeowner, you must be very clear about what you want and what kind of living environment you want to have in the future? Try to sort all these questions out clearly, or else there have to be unpredictable alterations in design and construction phases, since your preferences are constantly changing and will lead to doubts and uncertainties. All construction stages are interlocked with each other, so it is very important to make all information open and transparent during the pre-design discussion.

In addition, I do not recommend my clients to overfill the house as soon as they move in. There is a quite subtle “field” between space and people, which requires you to perceive and adapt to in a progressive way. Imagine that one day you encounter with a sofa or a work of painting, you take it home, and with the passage of time it creates a new emotional link with your space. This is the most interesting part of perfecting a home that is closely related with your own story.

▼罗秀达作品：“光之宅”。更多的自然光被引入一层和地下一层，改善了原先采光差的问题 ©效果图表现师：刘李卓
“The House of Light”. Natural light are introduced to the ground floor and the basement floor, so as to improve the poor daylighting of the original house

___
感悟
Insight

“所谓的审美和技术并不是终点，最后其实是要控制人的欲望。”

“The destination of design is not about aesthetics or techniques, it is about the control of human’s desire.”

做了一些年的设计师之后，你会慢慢地认识到一个事情，就是所谓的审美和技术并不是终点，最后其实是要控制人的欲望。有一些欲望是我们真实的需求，是生活中的柴米油盐，是我们每个人离不开的；有一些欲望并不是我们真正需要的，可能是虚荣，可能是短暂的爱好。真正做到大师级别的，像大家都熟知的贝聿铭、安藤忠雄，他们的作品都是很简单又很克制。回到室内设计上来说，有可能屋主只要求50分的内容，但你非要给他80分或者100分，而他刚好又相信你并且有能力辅助你，那不就是在左右别人的欲望吗？所以最终我们要思考的就是如何去平衡这些欲望。

我觉得现在大家对设计的想法还是有一点太趋同。每个人都有完全不同的性格和喜好，别人的东西是可以参考跟借鉴的，但还是要有自己的方向。从自己的方向出发，就不容易被时间所限制。你真心喜欢的东西，就算别人觉得没那么好，10年之后你也还是会喜欢它。所有人都追求同一个方向和风潮其实是一种浪费。如果能做到在装修之前就清楚自己的喜好、明确自己的需要，这将大大增加房子的使用年限，避免因为太快进入下一次装修而导致的材料和资源浪费。我想这对于整个社会的可持续性和良性发展来说都算是某种程度上的贡献。

After working as a designer for years, I have slowly realized that the destination of design is not about aesthetics or techniques, it is about the control of human’s desire. Desires can be what we truly need, which are the necessities that we can’t live without. Some desires are not generated from our true needs. They can be vanities, or just a short-lived fascination. True masterpieces are often presented with very simple and restrained features, as we can find in the work of those real masters like I.M. Pei and Tadao Ando. Going back to interior design, it is possible that the client only ask for 50%, but you forced him to reach 80% or 100% on the basis of his trust in you. This is tantamount to capriciously swaying the desires of others.

I think it would be a waste that everyone is catching up with the same trend. To clearly understand what you need is essential for creating a living environment that can continuously be well-functioning in the future, because it will help avoid the unnecessary waste of materials and resources brought by frequent alterations, and therefore make some small contribution to a more sustainable and virtuous development of the whole society.

▼罗秀达，Luo Xiuda © 图片由罗秀达提供

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明庭乡土自然学校，成都 / 活泼泼地

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